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Template talk:Real world
It was suggested in Ten Forward to make a template that would mark a page as real world POV as opposed to in universe POV. I remembered something they do at Wookiepedia for eras and I though it could be adapted to service us. At first I thought maybe icons tagging the articles with more info, like "tech", "people", whatever with background colors to separate real from in-universe. I talked about it on IRC and I was told that that would be too much. So I just decided that there would only be one tag, and all other articles would be assumed to be in-universe. The text and image are up for discussion. I chose Dr. Wykoff for what should be obvious reasons. Anyway, thats the idea. Comments? --Bp 23:13, 10 May 2006 (UTC) :Why the TM symbol? Jaz talk 23:32, 10 May 2006 (UTC) ::Maybe it's my imagination but that seems to be a tongue-in-cheek reference to the phrase restricted validity resource. :P --Vedek Dukat Talk | Duty Roster 23:39, 10 May 2006 (UTC) Yeah its justa stupid joke. The text will have to be something different. Maybe just "Reality" or something. That also sounds jokey. I dunno. Suggestions please. --Bp 23:45, 10 May 2006 (UTC) :::Suggestion: :::>>> This article is written from a Production POV <<< :::Further comments regarding this template on MA:TF. -- Cid Highwind 10:01, 11 May 2006 (UTC) ::::I expanded "POV" to "point of view" just for clarity's sake, reorganized the text to 3 lines to better fill the space in the box, and shrunk the box a bit to eliminate extra space. Do we want to keep "Real World", or use "Production" or some other phrase? -- Renegade54 13:21, 11 May 2006 (UTC) :::::I like the design! I have no real input on the wording, it might still need work but i'm at a loss what would help. :::::what i do know is that this would be easy to include in episode pages -- through the sidebar templates. :)-- Captain M.K.B. 13:32, 11 May 2006 (UTC) :::I wouldn't want to include it in the sidebar template itself, but if all the pages have to be touched anyway, it would be easy to add this template at the same time. Alternatively, this seems to be an easy bot task for most of the pages - as long as there's a list that contains only these Production (or whatever) POV articles, it should be fine. -- Cid Highwind 14:06, 11 May 2006 (UTC) ::About the Wykoff thing, From the article: :::According to Wykoff, the only real chance Russell had at recovering his sanity was to cease writing these stories as he believed they were providing an entirely false world for him. '' :::''Russell refused to give up his stories and became increasingly unstable when he could no longer separate his 'fiction' from reality. '' ::As Wykoff tried to help Benny separate the real world from fiction, this template will separate the Real World articles from the Star Trek universe articles. At least that was the reference or joke. That's why I put Wykoff in the box and used "Real World". If the Wykoff picture is out, then the "Real World" should be changed to something more straight as well. Like "production" suggested earlier. ::Also, you can see how it will look on articles at Lolita Fatjo. --Bp 16:29, 11 May 2006 (UTC) :I have suggested a compromise, it's a filmstrip with Wykoff in the frame. So what do you think of that Cid? --Bp 03:02, 20 May 2006 (UTC) ::Honestly, not much, I'm afraid. This Wykoff thing was an obscure reference/joke from the beginning, now it's an obscure reference that additionally isn't even recognizable due to the image itself being so small. I think there are two options: If it is more important for this message to be "funny" than to be "instantly recognizable", then we should go back to the Wykoff image without any alteration. If the opposite is the case, we should use an icon. Trying to have both at the same time will only achieve neither... Obviously, I personally prefer the latter option. -- Cid Highwind 16:45, 20 May 2006 (UTC) :I would say that one isn't more important than the other, they are equally important! It's just as recognizable as a piece of film as the last one. The reference is just a little added fun. I wouldn't really call it obscure, the reference is pretty obvious, Dr. Wykoff tried to make Benny separate fiction from reality. the image may be small, but if you see the original Wykoff picture it is still obvious enough they are the same, and even if you dont know who the man is in the picture, it is obviously a man on film. It still achieves everything the plain white-on-black icon did, just with something extra. --Bp 18:36, 20 May 2006 (UTC) ::::::Personally, I love the template as it is, although I agree that "production pov" would probably be better than "real world pov". The image, I think, is fine the way it is: it's a man on a film strip, indicating a production pov. The fact that the image is of Dr. Wykoff is a nice touch that doesn't hurt the template any; it's a great little reference to the seperation of reality and fiction. Sure, people may not recognize him at first, but once (and if) they do and they get the reference, they'll be like "oh, yeah!" And if they never get the reference, then oh, well. No harm, no foul. I see nothing wrong with it. (A bit off-topic – I just had the strangest feeling of deja vu, like I had written this comment before. Oh, well...) --From Andoria with Love 23:12, 25 May 2006 (UTC) Template usage Is there a policy about where the template is to be used? I mean a user recently added it to novel pages. I find that doubtful, because except for the navigation and book sidebar the text follows our . If it is to be added to the novels it soon has to go to the movies and episodes as well, but there too the main body is not written from the POV of the audience. -- Kobi 08:43, 5 July 2006 (UTC) :Some people have already been adding it to the episode summaries, something I'm not entirely certain I agree with. -- Sulfur 11:54, 5 July 2006 (UTC) ::Well, aren't episode pages as a whole ''supposed to be written from a production POV (BTW, I still don't agree with the wording "real world", because "production" is what we use in all other cases)? They aren't in-universe articles, right? -- Cid Highwind 11:57, 5 July 2006 (UTC) :::The episode pages are a mix. The mini-summary at the top is kindof a production/real world pov, while the bigger summary seems to be a far-future historian in-universe POV, yet one that is also cognizant of alternate timelines, personal secrets, and other things that only the viewers would know about. Then everything else like backgound info and guest list is production info/pov. It think the it should probably be left off of episodes. Episodes are already obvious due to the episode sidebar. --Bp 01:34, 6 July 2006 (UTC) ::That doesn't make any sense. Obviously, the summary section contains a summary of the story of a published product (=production POV), not a summary of in-universe events that are, for reasons unknown, padded out with information that should be unknown in-universe, and split up in "Act/Chapter 1-X" subsections that are absolutely useless from an in-universe POV. Episode articles, as a whole, are "production POV". -- Cid Highwind 12:12, 6 July 2006 (UTC) :::The story is in-universe. The episode summary is (or should be) a condensed version of what you see on screen, which is in-universe. Just because we, as viewers, are privy to multiple storylines at once, giving us information that characters might not have in one story line or another, doesn't mean that it's not an in-universe POV. The production stuff is (or should be) limited to the background section (or in some rare cases, italicized text within the body). All the terms we're defining as in universe articles are from information gleaned from the episodes themselves; if the episodes aren't in-universe, then neither is the information taken from them. -- Renegade54 14:43, 6 July 2006 (UTC) ::::I'm with Sulfur- the realworld template doesn't seem right on these pages. I think the episode, movie, and novel pages are really a third type of thing: not entirely real-word, and not really in-universe either. I don't think an additional template is required. The episode, movie, and novel templates already speak to this. 9er 15:05, 6 July 2006 (UTC) Actors who were characters of the same name Recently there have been some found "mix ups" with adding template:realworld to "actors who were also characters" articles, like Stephen Hawking, Dwight Frye, etc, and would to do with these pages by creating a separate page for the "actor" (ie Stephen Hawking (actor) from the "character" (ie Stephen Hawking). It seems we did something similiar with Maury Ginsberg/Maury Ginsberg (actor).--Alan del Beccio 19:27, 8 July 2006 (UTC)